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ENDLESS™ Space 2 is turn-based 4X space-strategy that launches players into the space colonization age of different civilizations within the ENDLESS™ Universe. Your Vision. Their Future.

Frogsquadron

Frogsquadron

7 years ago Jan 24,2017, 17:01:56 PM

Horatio Update - Focus on the tech tree

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Hey everyone!


The Horatio update is looming closer! In this second update for Endless Space 2, we are inaugurating a new, revamped version of the tech tree, following extensive feedback from the community. Most of you asked for a tech tree that would be closer in feel to the original Endless Space than Endless Legend, with a tree branching out instead of tech being freely accessible by era. To that end, we've moved from a global era system to a stage system per scientific domain:

  • Science & Exploration
  • Empire Development
  • Military
  • Economy & Trade

To get to the next stage of a domain, you need to possess half the technologies of the previous stages, either through trade or research.





New links were added between technologies, to group them thematically in a more meaningful manner. Cost reduction links mean that researching a technology lowers the cost of the next technology in line. This way, we create a nice "shortcut" to a deeper understanding of a technology without making it mandatory to research the earlier versions of it. Exclusion links mean that researching one of the technologies in the pair means being unable to research the other. This way, players have to make a choice early on, and only through diplomacy will they be able to shore up this specific weakness.


Dynamic costs were kept to preserve a somewhat linear pace of technology unlocking (about 1 tech every 5 turns on average). Costs depend on a technology's stage, this way it is possible to dive deeply in a single specific domain, but it has consequences on the global costs, even if the early stages will still be quite accessible.


We've also redone the look for a more sci-fi feel, akin to a motherboard's circuits. Part of this redesign involved integrating the Deeds better within the tech tree, and adding a color- and icon- coding to identify at a glance the nature of the technology's unlocks. The veterans will be able to select their path at a glance, but everyone will be able to zoom in and hover over techs and unlocks as required.





Compared to Update 1 and before, this means that Endless Space 2 renews with asymmetric progression of the various domains. For this and the other changes, we would like to know: what do you think of the new visual direction? What do you think of the gameplay feel? We're not done with the tech tree yet, so your continued feedback is important!



Side note: we know tech unlock is currently a bit fast in the Update preview, it's meant for you to be able to toy with the tech tree faster (and thus more often) than you normally would in a game, so disregard the speed of tech progression in favor of your feelings on the rest of it!



That's all for now. Come back tomorrow for more on the features of the Horatio Update!





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7 years ago
Jan 24, 2017, 5:14:00 PM

Is the position of the scientific victory techs definitive ? 


I feel like having them right there in era 5 makes the other era 5 techs less useful: why research them and enjoy playing with them when you could just research the victory techs and win right away ? In my opinion they should be locked until you have researched other era 5 techs (like a 6th era basically).


Likewise for the wonder victory, unlocking the improvement so soon greatly reduce the time in era 5.


In short the issue is that currently reaching era 5 really puts a short timer on the game because of the wonder and scientific victories. 

Updated 7 years ago.
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7 years ago
Jan 24, 2017, 6:09:53 PM

Add a legend explaining the links, technology type icons and colors. Could pop up by pressing space like the scan view.

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7 years ago
Jan 24, 2017, 6:25:03 PM

To answer your questions:


- What do you think of the new visual direction?

I would prefer the thumbnails of the previous tech tree. These were easy to read and after one game I was familiar with the tech tree. Bigger thumbnails are easier to read and understand, these pictures gave a good impression what the tech was about. I get your idea of color coding the icons. This is a good addition. I guess you can't have both. The further away zoom lacks a lot of information. There are only tech circles and lines (either discount or exclusive). There should also be a color coding, otherwise this zoom level is obsolete.
Besides that the new design is really nice.


- What do you think of the gameplay feel?

Just one recommendation: Please look into the unlock of military techs (weapons and defensive shields/armor). Ressource dependent weapons/armors should not be outdated easily if you advance too quickly into a new era. What I mean for example the titanium weapons tier 1 in era 2 should not be outdated by the standard tier weapons if you unlock era 3. Granted, I haven't looked deeply into this and will try to compare the weapons stats. I will update my post if I see no problem here.


Keep up the good work. Really great, that you listened to the community. Even if I was pleased with the era system. I like how the new tech tree is shaping up.

Updated 7 years ago.
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7 years ago
Jan 24, 2017, 6:35:35 PM

In terms of icon replacements, for unfound techs, what I would love is this:

(with better arts :) )


The "when found" part would use the actual new icons (gray or not).


This would help a lot to:

- recognize what is to be found

- recognize the icons 

- be sure an item is science / food (if the outer border of the big circle is thick enough, because those "ear-like" icon are super cool but the borders are too thin for me to recognize well if an invention is political or war for exemple (colours are too close))


Otherwise for now, I'm still experiencing this stuff. I like it a lot.

Updated 7 years ago.
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7 years ago
Jan 24, 2017, 10:03:48 PM

Played a little and notice that the "resource" weapons / defences are way to week for current tech tree set up.

It is even worse then it was before as I get resource costing weapons with worst stats then the standard ones available.

The problem is that you can easily jump to higher level in a given tech.

So I end up with level 1 resource weapons / defences (which are essentially level 2 modules) and having available level 3 basic modules.


You go to Level 2 modules to fast in my opinion (just after 1 tech).
The you get to level 3 modules after just another single military tech.


The pace is way out of balance and the "special" modules are simply to week to consider using them.
"Focused Plasma" and "Unstable isotope machining" get obsolete the moment you research them.


Solutions:

1) Increase number of researchable techs at level 1 and 2 so that you would need to research more to get next level modules.

2) Weapon / defences that need resources need to be on corresponding levels (L1 resource weapon at level 1 in tech tree).

3) Special weapons / defence need to be better then their counter parts from next level (Level 1 resource weapon should be better than standard Level 2 weapon).

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7 years ago
Jan 24, 2017, 10:15:18 PM

Yes! This tech tree looks much better. Now change the combat to be like ES1 but with improvements and all my concerns will be addressed. ES combat > EL combat.


Can't wait to play in any case! 

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7 years ago
Jan 24, 2017, 10:52:50 PM

This is a great improvement! Even the aesthetic is much better. The only thing I can think of off the top of my head is having different colours for different categories. E.g. blue for science tree, red for military tree, etc. whereas in the image you showed the lines are all red and yellow.

Updated 7 years ago.
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7 years ago
Jan 24, 2017, 11:20:11 PM

I like it a lot. I find it a huge improvement over the previous tech system. I only have one complaint: When researching the technology that gives you new battle cards, it doesn't show you what the cards do (positionally and their effect) but only the names. Until I play enough to have them all memorized I am not really sure if I am picking a smart set of cards for my ship designs or not.


I would love to be able to see the cards in a tooltip when mousing over their icon on the techtree perhaps?



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7 years ago
Jan 25, 2017, 5:06:38 AM
AndreasK wrote:

Add a legend explaining the links, technology type icons and colors. Could pop up by pressing space like the scan view.

I agree with AndreasK. A little bit more visual feedback is needed for the new tech tree.

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7 years ago
Jan 25, 2017, 8:51:10 AM

Thank you everyone for your feedback so far. I'll keep passing it on as you post.



Ccoommer wrote:

Yes! This tech tree looks much better. Now change the combat to be like ES1 but with improvements and all my concerns will be addressed. ES combat > EL combat.


Can't wait to play in any case! 


I'm curious how you think combat in Endless Space 2 is similar to Endless Legend? The two are literally nothing alike.

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7 years ago
Jan 25, 2017, 9:03:46 AM

Thank you all for your feedback! 


I feel like having them right there in era 5 makes the other era 5 techs less useful: why research them and enjoy playing with them when you could just research the victory techs and win right away ? In my opinion they should be locked until you have researched other era 5 techs (like a 6th era basically).

  • We’re looking into it and plan to release it for Update 3: how to enhance the Science Victory Technology. They indeed need to stand out :)

Add a legend explaining the links, technology type icons and colors. Could pop up by pressing space like the scan view.

  • That will be in the release of the Update 2!

I would prefer the thumbnails of the previous tech tree. These were easy to read and after one game I was familiar with the tech tree. Bigger thumbnails are easier to read and understand, these pictures gave a good impression what the tech was about. I get your idea of color coding the icons. This is a good addition. I guess you can't have both. The further away zoom lacks a lot of information. There are only tech circles and lines (either discount or exclusive). There should also be a color coding, otherwise this zoom level is obsolete.
Besides that the new design is really nice.

  • We will keep working on the readability in the coming weeks.

Just one recommendation: Please look into the unlock of military techs (weapons and defensive shields/armor). Ressource dependent weapons/armors should not be outdated easily if you advance too quickly into a new era. What I mean for example the titanium weapons tier 1 in era 2 should not be outdated by the standard tier weapons if you unlock era 3. Granted, I haven't looked deeply into this and will try to compare the weapons stats. I will update my post if I see no problem here.

Played a little and notice that the "resource" weapons / defences are way to week for current tech tree set up.

It is even worse then it was before as I get resource costing weapons with worst stats then the standard ones available.

The problem is that you can easily jump to higher level in a given tech.

So I end up with level 1 resource weapons / defences (which are essentially level 2 modules) and having available level 3 basic modules.

  • We’re working on the balance of the different modules to not provide this outdated feeling too fast. A lot more has to come with the Update 3 on the battle content, but for the Update 2 we focused on polishing the global game system (using the decks, and retaking how weapons / defences interact together).

I like it a lot. I find it a huge improvement over the previous tech system. I only have one complaint: When researching the technology that gives you new battle cards, it doesn't show you what the cards do (positionally and their effect) but only the names. Until I play enough to have them all memorized I am not really sure if I am picking a smart set of cards for my ship designs or not.

  • A few unlocks deserve a better tooltip. That’s something we will look at it soon!

Cheers,


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7 years ago
Jan 25, 2017, 9:11:40 AM

I have been toying with Privateer Fleet option while playing as the United Empire. I feel there should be a space for a separate base construction for Privateer Fleets where they can be interacted and re-designed. The other AI players will see the base as neutral/pirate domain. The base can be a single planet like Traitor's Reach or could be just a outpost which could not be upgraded to colony; I dont know whether this can be implemented within current development plans, but it will be nice and will add some flexibility in tactical layer of the game. Alternatively The privateer fleet base can act as a totally separate faction like other minor factions; just they are loyal to the player (Relationship declination set to zero). This option may be faction specific. 

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7 years ago
Jan 25, 2017, 2:47:14 PM
Could you guys give Humble Bundle some keys for Endless Space 2 for the Humble Monthly?? Love the game, can't buy it at the moment!
Love you guys...



-Axel


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7 years ago
Jan 26, 2017, 2:03:01 AM

"Exclusion links mean that researching one of the technologies in the pair means being unable to research the other. This way, players have to make a choice early on, and only through diplomacy will they be able to shore up this specific weakness."

So, for example, let's say I chose to go with Titanium (which locks out the other resource). Later on, my inner tech-hoarder is unleashed and I decide that I want to get the locked out techs. Does this mean I can trade for them via diplomacy or are they locked out for good (i.e., I can't get them even if I ask for them from allies)?

Updated 7 years ago.
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